A few brief and scattered thoughts on the following article:
http://idsblog.org/?p=293#more-293
I agree with the main idea of this article, that "the essence of Christian love is the Gospel". It is true that we should love all people, and the preaching the Gospel is the very center of that love. However, I must offer my critique of his "critique" sections.
From critique 1: "I am not a border patrol agent or a policeman."
(Smell like a fallacy to anyone else?) He explains that it is not his responsibility to turn people in to the authorities. I happen to agree with this statement, it is not his responsibility, BUT...
"if we argue that it is our job to uphold God’s righteousness by stopping illegal aliens from sinning, then we need to be consistent and uphold God’s righteousness by stopping people from cursing or saying anything that is not encouraging (Ephesians 4:29). Our job as ambassadors for Christ is to tell people how to get right with God, not to stop people from sinning."
I admit, he is consistent in condemning the straw man he created in the "Viewpoint #1" section. However, most Christians actually argue viewpoint #1 NOT by saying "I have a moral obligation to STOP ALL SIN!" but rather "I have a moral obligation to CONDEMN sin". The manner in which a person should do so is where I differ (only slightly) from these folks. My question to the writer is this: If it is not your moral responsibility to stop people from cursing or saying non-encouraging things, then what IS your responsibility regarding those things? You will not find the answer in Ephesians 4:29 (which is taken VIOLENTLY out of context, since Paul is specifically addressing believers), but rather in the gospels. Matt 3:2, 4:17, Mark 6:12, 16:15 (to name a few) all make it quite clear that we are to preach a gospel of repentance. This means ADDRESSING sins! Condemning sin and calling folks to repent is CENTRAL to preaching the gospel. Our job is not merely to "tell people how to get right with God" but to preach "Repent, for the Kingdom of God is at hand." This can not be done without addressing very real sins immediately, rather than taking the "Let's be friends, then I'll PERMISSION EVANGELIZE you, then you'll believe in Jesus without hearing that the Law of God condemns you, and THEN we will talk about your sins, and MAYBE you will ACTUALLY repent of your sins" approach which is so popular among some Evangelicals. Instead, REPENTANCE and FAITH are gifts from God that come together as a result of the Holy Spirit bringing light to the true gospel within the heart of man.
This is exactly what should NOT happen: "This means that as I am meeting with my friend who is an illegal alien and I have cared for him and shared the gospel with him and God has changed his heart, there will be a point at which I will have to challenge him that he is currently in sin."
Repentance and faith come TOGETHER. Conviction of sin and belief in the God of the Bible come TOGETHER. Not separately. Period. Exclamation Point! These are the listed events: Share the gospel, God changes his heart, Challenge him that he is in sin. Ummmmm..... If you didn't already challenge him that he is in sin, then what exactly did he repent of? In fact, why does he believe that he needs a savior if you haven't already pointed out that things he is doing are sins? There's simply no way around it. It is true that we need to love illegal immigrants, and to preach the gospel, but we must not compromise on what it MEANS to preach the gospel.
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8 comments:
What I found amazing about this ids article was the argument that since I am not an FBI agent, I have no obligation to assist the governing authorities in upholding the laws of the land. Sooo, if I see a murderer hiding out at my church I am not to call the police? If a pedophile is hiding out at my church I am not to call the police? If a bank robber is hiding out at my church I am not to call the police? My point is obvious: we are supposed to assist our government in fighting crime. It is our duty as citizens AND as Christian people. I would even suggest that a Christian is not submitting to the government when one turns a blind eye to lawbreakers.
I cringed at the author's statement that "we are not longer under law, but under grace..." Well, okay, we are in the New Testament, therefore we don't uphold the laws of our government? Or, because we are in the NT we don't assist our government in doing the right thing?
So how would a Christian go about dealing with an illegal alien attending his church? He would tell his elders right away. There is not a question in my mind. They would then probably ask the professing Christian (yet illegal alien) to repent of his sin and turn himself over to the authorities so he could be properly deported. It's that simple.
Good thoughts man.
You have been tagged, via my blog =)
Prince Cor and Rusty,
Although I agree with what you're saying in many ways, I detect a bit of a cynical tone in what you're saying...is that the case?
You say, "Sooo, if I see a murderer hiding out at my church I am not to call the police? If a pedophile is hiding out at my church I am not to call the police? If a bank robber is hiding out at my church I am not to call the police?". I am just a little confused on how we jumped from illegal immigrant to murderer...one thing is to turn someone in for putting others in danger and the other is someone that, yes, is breaking the law, but is not putting any human being in harm, unless of course you consider harm to be maybe occupying some job that any normal middle-class american would be reluctant to take. Honestly, I don't see many white day laborers...it's just not common...the great majority of people in our culture don't want those jobs.
Also, in our ministry (as a family), we do not hesitate in confronting the sin. But if you automatically turn in illegal immigrants then what good can come from that? Yes, maybe it might perhaps aid our economy, but what about the kingdom? We may be the only light that those people may see of the gospel in their entire lives.
Here's a tangible example...if you heard that one of your closest friends was doing drugs, you wouldn't automatically turn him in without first counseling him to turn away from his sin and taking him to the scripture to show him why what he's doing is wrong and how he needs to repent. The example applies in some of the same ways with illegal immigrants...yes, what they're doing is wrong, it's breaking the law, but before you immediately call the police, counsel them to turn from their sin and follow Christ and that includes going back to Mexico if they are here illegally. There's no other option...but this must be done in love, just as though you were confronting a brother in sin.
I'll be honest, much of my experience in Mexico has shown me how much everyone needs the gospel. It would be irresponsible, as believers, to automatically deport someone without first showing them their sin and their need for a savior because that's what all sin goes back to. A lot of my opinion comes from my experience and the fact that I love these people dearly. What is necessary to remember is to love the sinner BUT condemn the sin.
Honestly, I can't prove this to you. Like I said previously, much of my opinion comes from my experience in Mexico and nothing can take the place of what I saw there and the many things that I learned. Nothing here in the US can show you that. I am sure that my argument is definitely flawed in many ways to be sure, but I believe that it is necessary to love. Yes, it is also necessary to confront others on sin, but scripture itself says to do this in love. Please know that I in no way know everything about the issue and I would love to hear your opinion on it even if we happen to disagree I believe that I still have a lot to learn.
Amy Paasch,
Thanks for your comments on the subject. However, I would like to encourage you to re-read my post and Rusty's comment, because I don't think your understood or accurately represented our arguments. For one thing, the connection between bank robbers, pedophiles, murderers, and illegal immigrants is they are all felons. Each one of these individuals is violating federal law. They were NOT listed together because they all endanger other people. Rusty's argument was that citizens of the USA have a moral obligation to assist the governing authorities in upholding the laws of the land. Do you disagree?
Also, you said: "Also, in our ministry (as a family), we do not hesitate in confronting the sin. But if you automatically turn in illegal immigrants then what good can come from that? Yes, maybe it might perhaps aid our economy, but what about the kingdom? We may be the only light that those people may see of the gospel in their entire lives."
Amy, my argument was actually that you CAN NOT preach the gospel without telling an unbeliever to repent of their sin. That means that if you know that a person is an illegal immigrant, you are obligated to challenge them to repent. What I did NOT say is "Call the police and DO NOT preach the gospel!" Also, I would argue that a believer/US citizen is obligated to turn in any felon who refuses to repent (turn themself in) NOT because it benefits the economy, but because we are subject to the laws of our country. Do you disagree?
Hey Amy =)
You said, “Although I agree with what you're saying in many ways, I detect a bit of a cynical tone in what you're saying...is that the case?”
No, that is not the case.
You said, “You say, "Sooo, if I see a murderer hiding out at my church I am not to call the police? If a pedophile is hiding out at my church I am not to call the police? If a bank robber is hiding out at my church I am not to call the police?". I am just a little confused on how we jumped from illegal immigrant to murderer...one thing is to turn someone in for putting others in danger and the other is someone that, yes, is breaking the law, but is not putting any human being in harm,…”
Cory was correct that I was not trying to equate the act of murder, pedophilia and thievery with immigrating illegally. In fact, the reason I chose those three crimes was an attempt to communicate different types of crime.
I agree that we should use discernment in how we respond to lawbreakers who’ve committed crimes of different severities. I will react differently towards a murderer than I would a bank robber. In the same way, I would respond differently to a bank robber than an illegal immigrant. But the common element found in my response to the murderer, the bank robber and the illegal immigrant, is that I would involve the governing authorities.
Romans 13:1-6 says, “6Every person is to be in subjection to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God. 2 Therefore whoever resists authority has opposed the ordinance of God; and they who have opposed will receive condemnation upon themselves. 3 For rulers are not a cause of fear for good behavior, but for evil. Do you want to have no fear of authority? Do what is good and you will have praise from the same; 4 for it is a minister of God to you for good. But if you do what is evil, be afraid; for it does not bear the sword for nothing; for it is a minister of God, an avenger who brings wrath on the one who practices evil. 5 Therefore it is necessary to be in subjection, not only because of wrath, but also for conscience' sake. 6 For because of this you also pay taxes, for rulers are servants of God, devoting themselves to this very thing.” (NASB).
The government of the United States (along with most governments in our modern age) has strict immigration policies. The USA actually considers it a felony, a crime against the state, to illegally enter her space. Since the Apostle Paul commands Christians to submit to the governing authorities, indeed, not even to resist the defense of their own laws, should we not take it upon ourselves as believers in Christ to honor their God-given authority?
You continued, “…unless of course you consider harm to be maybe occupying some job that any normal middle-class [A]merican would be reluctant to take. Honestly, I don't see many white day laborers...it's just not common...the great majority of people in our culture don't want those jobs.”
There is no physical harm in an illegal immigrant taking jobs from middle-class Americans, but there certainly is economic harm. My dad was actually a foremen for a large framing company, and he is very white =). Now that he is a General Supervisor for his company, now named Select Build Inc., he is in charge of hiring/firing many of the crews in AZ and he would fervently disagree with your assumption that white or middle-class Americans do not want jobs involving manual labor. Not to mention that in my personal experience I can name dozens upon dozens of our family friends who are white construction workers – and many more non-white middle-class citizens.
You said, “Also, in our ministry (as a family), we do not hesitate in confronting the sin. But if you automatically turn in illegal immigrants then what good can come from that? Yes, maybe it might perhaps aid our economy, but what about the kingdom? We may be the only light that those people may see of the gospel in their entire lives.”
I commend you and your family for confronting the many sin issues at the root of wrongfully entering a foreign nation. What good can come from automatically turning in an illegal immigrant with no warning? I imagine not much. I very much support encouraging the person to turn themselves in; however, if they fail to do so, it is every citizen’s duty to aid the government in returning illegals back to their home country.
A Christian should preach the gospel to every one, illegal alien and citizen alike. Looks like we agree here =)
Thanks for your thoughts. It’s 3:35am, and it’s time for beddy by! =)
Casey of Basey
Prince Cor,
In response to your comment, I do understand your argument, but my argument was more towards Rusty's argument only because I believe that perhaps you misunderstood the what the author was trying to say. I don't think he's saying don't confront the sin, but my question is...how will someone be willing to turn from their sin unless they have the Holy Spirit in them?
First, I believe, they need salvation. Secondly, I do agree that we are obligated to fulfill our duty to the government, but I think that turning an illegal immigrant in is going to be more of a process than just counseling them that they're in sin and then...if they don't automatically respond then you call the police. Sin is difficult to work through, no matter what it is and the heart gets caught in sin many times. Many times repentance from sin comes in steps, not immediately.
My point about the criminal thing, Rusty already kind of completed. I just wanted to make sure that you weren't saying that you would treat all three of those scenarios in the same way.
Rusty, when I was referring to American jobs, I am not referring to all physical labor jobs whatsoever, but day-laborers in general. I've found that a good majority of Americans want a stable job not just a daily recruitement. I might be wrong on that...like I said my argument most certainly has flaws...but that's what I've seen in statistics and in daily life.
Thank you so much to the both of you for taking the time to respond. I appreciate that greatly!
Hey there Cory! I will indeed honor you with my thoughts... I haven't taken time to read all of the comments yet, though, so I'll probably be posting again in a minute. Real quickly...
Let me just tell you straight up... this is a great post. I've taken a while to think it over, because I've been very volatile about this subject in the past, and I very much want to stop and consider before I speak. (My passion can sometimes run away with me.)
All of this is great...
"This can not be done without addressing very real sins immediately, rather than taking the "Let's be friends, then I'll PERMISSION EVANGELIZE you, then you'll believe in Jesus without hearing that the Law of God condemns you, and THEN we will talk about your sins, and MAYBE you will ACTUALLY repent of your sins" approach which is so popular among some Evangelicals. Instead, REPENTANCE and FAITH are gifts from God that come together as a result of the Holy Spirit bringing light to the true gospel within the heart of man."
Let me put your mind at ease... this is not at all the kind of ministry that we do with illegal aliens. Let me explain. We have a local ministry in Chandler, Pan de Vida, in the midst of a very Hispanic neighborhood. We invite all Spanish-speaking people to this service. At the door, we do not check their ID, though. It is our goal to love them, serve them, and share the Gospel with them, teaching repentance of sins. We do not know - often for quite some time - who is illegal and who is not. However, once we find out, we do indeed urge them to repent and to get right with the law. Just as if you had a friend that you found out had a drug problem, I do not think you would immediately turn them into the authorities.
We have had to deal with a lot of problems with illegal aliens becoming believers. Often we do not find out their legal status until AFTER they come to know the Lord, or at least begin attending Pan de Vida regularly. Each and every time, we have held them responsible to either go back to Mexico permanently or to attain legal status immediately.
Many illegal aliens do not see what they are doing as sin. This does not make it any less wrong. It is our duty and responsibility to make this clear to them. It is not our desire to fudge on truth in any way.
I think Amy made a good point, though... even though repentance and faith come together, this life change is also a process. Even though he may realized that what he is doing is wrong and repent of his sin, a drug addict does not easily just suddenly up and quit. We try to be understanding with new believers and explain the truth to them in a gracious way, but we do indeed hold them accountable to change.
Some of this I feel I cannot explain, really, because of a lot of what my viewpoint is has come spending time with the Hispanic people, understanding their life situations, and learning to love them. I wish I could put it into words fully, but I can't.
I will not hide the fact that I believe a lot of change could and should be made with our country's border system. Based on a lot of experience I have with that system and the experiences of many close to me, I am very disappointed with the way that our government has handled relations with our southern neighbors. The United States is indeed doing itself a great disservice there. I do not wish to discuss this here; I do not feel discussion of the politics side of the issue would be at all profitable. I believe, in the end, that our focus should be on the kingdom that is coming, more than this one. However, we are called to obey our authorities, and we try to hold people accountable to do that to the best of our ability.
A lot of controversy has come up with our involvement in a local shelter for day laborers, not far from where Pan de Vida is located - I don't want to go into detail with that issue (that is really a whole new can of worms), but the goal, there, short and simple, is to be Christ to the day laborers who stand on the streets of Chandler every day, offering them water, at times food, shade, and a place to congregate. Even I do not fully understand the process that takes place there - our connection with that establishment is very limited - so I will not address it in detail. I just want you to know that the object is not to IN ANY WAY aid people in breaking the law or continuing to do so... God forbid! We see the poor Hispanic population - illegal or otherwise - as an excellent mission field, especially considering our former mission work in Mexico and our knowledge of the language. What can I say? I love them.
Here are a few of my thoughts, Cory. I'm sure there will be more. I'm also sure I probably said everything all wrong, and will have to write a whole another comment trying to MAKE CLEAR what I just said. ;) Let me know what you think.
God bless, friend -
~ Hannah
Keep up the good work.
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